Browsing Posts in Seats

It’s certainly interesting to watch the Japanese market these days. JAL is turning in record losses and is effectively sitting on a cliff waiting to jump. Meanwhile, ANA has decided to pour a bunch of money into seriously improving its product. This is some pretty impressive looking stuff. Take a look at the new first class suite.

ANA First Suite

Pretty awesome-looking, huh? But let’s start with coach since that’s where most of us will end up anyway. Coach seats will have 34 inch pitch, so pretty nice legroom, along with headrests AND footrests. Footrests in coach?! Hooray! They will also have 10.6 inch monitors with full audio/video on demand, iPod connectors, USB ports, and power outlets.

ANA New Coach Seats

In addition, they’ve decided to lay the cabin out in a 2-4-3 configuration. I personally love this configuration because it gives options to people regardless of the size of the party. And nobody gets stuck in the middle of a section of 5. Granted, it required three different types of seat sets (set of 2, set of 3, and set of 4), so it makes things a little more difficult logistically, but from a customer perspective, I don’t think it can be beat.

ANA is also rolling out a premium economy class with a 2-4-2 configuration with 42 inch pitch. The big selling point here is that there are dividers between seats that can move if you so choose, and the epic armrest struggle is unnecessary since there is a double-wide available. Take a look:

ANA New Premium Economy Seat

Now let’s get to the fancy stuff. Business Class seats will go fully flat in a 1-2-1 configuration so everybody has an aisle. The seats are set up in a staggered way, so you’ll have your seat with your feet going under a table in the seat in front of you. Take a look at this release for an overview of what I’m talking about. The screen here is 17 inches and the service is upgraded. They’re even taking a page from the Virgin America playbook by allowing customers to order their meals on the touchscreen whenever they feel like eating.

ANA Business Seat

Now let’s get back to that first class suite that they’re calling the First Square. This is also in a 1-2-1 configuration but it afford complete privacy from the outside world, just like on Emirates, Singapore, and the like. The screen is 23 inches (anyone else remember when having a 19 inch tv at home was a big deal?) and it has all the amenities you could imagine.

As if that’s not enough, in Tokyo, they’re introducing Suite Check-in for the fancy pants fliers. You go to a private suite where they check you in, take your bags, and put you through security. They’re also creating Suite Lounges so you can have your own private workspace while you wait. Just unreal stuff.

In the air, the changes will begin rolling out on the 777-300ER aircraft beginning on February 20. This will start on the Tokyo-JFK route every other day and it will go on to the Tokyo-London and Tokyo-Frankfurt routes by the end of 2010. In 2011, it will go on the other US and Europe routes.

Tell me you don’t want to try it. That’s what I thought.

US Airways announced this morning that they will be rolling out a nicer, more attractive version of the business class seat that was rumored to be coming back in June. Let’s be honest. You don’t think of luxury product innovation when you think of US Airways, but they appear to have really come through on this one.

The new seat is called the Envoy Suite, and it will first go on the A330-200s that just started coming into the fleet recently. This makes sense because those are the ones deployed on the longest-haul flights to places like Tel Aviv and, eventually, Tokyo. By Fall of 2010, the existing A330-200s will be refitted with the new seat, designed by SICMA, and all future deliveries will have it as well.

New US Airways Business Class Seat

The seat itself is in a reverse herringbone style with a 1-2-1 layout. So instead of your back against the wall looking toward the aisle like in a herringbone, your back is against the aisle looking toward the window or middle. So if you’re sitting in the window, it provides a fantastic view. If you’re sitting in the middle (what you see in the photo above), there still seems to be enough blocking so that you don’t have to deal with the person next to you.

Now that picture above doesn’t look completely flat to me, but according to US Airways, the seat will go down into a 6’4″ or 6’8″ 180 degree flat bed depending upon which seat you have in the cabin. The seat width is 20.5″ with the armrests up, but when they go down, the width is 25″ for sleeping.

I asked about storage since that is a big problem with many business class seats, and this one doesn’t look much better. There is a bunch of room under the ottoman when you’re in flight, but I believe that won’t be allowed to be used during takeoff and landing. So you’ll need your bin space on this one. I have confirmed that storage underneath the seat will be allowed during takeoff and landing. That’s great.

I was particularly interested in the weight of this seat. My understanding is that the herringbone design is very heavy, because it requires pallets to be secured properly. I have been told, however, that this seat does not require pallets and will only weigh 20 to 30 pounds more than the existing seat.

There are also all the standard amenities. Yes, there is a 110V power outlet, a USB port, and a 12.1″ screen with audio/video on demand. Sounds very good, so why is US Airways doing this? Good question. They’re going to have to lose seats on this plane, because the reverse herringbone takes up more space than the current seats. My guess is that if you think about US Airways and their traffic mix, this may actually make sense.

How many of those business class seats is US Airways selling today? My guess is that there are an overwhelming number of upgrades there. So even though there will be fewer seats going forward, they will probably be able to sell them since they are now competitive on the world stage. That’s really the only reason I can imagine that this would make sense for US Airways to do.

When will we get to see this on the rest of the international fleet? Well you’ll never see it on the 767s. Those will be retired soon enough. The A330-300s, however, will get a new seat but not exactly this one. Apparently it doesn’t quite fit perfectly on the A330 so some tweaking will be required. Once they figure that out, they’ll announce it.

It’s a very big step forward for US Airways, and it should certainly make flying the airline internationally a much nicer experience.

See a video and interactive demo on the new seat

Edited 9/18 @ 327p to change info about storage space

In 2003, I found myself sitting in the Business Elite cabin on a 767 going from JFK to San Francisco on Delta. It was a very nice ride, but that service was soon discontinued. Delta has tried a few things between New York and LA/SF, but for the most part it has been a standard domestic service. That’s going to change once again.

Flights between JFK and both LA and SF will now be on internationally-configured 757s. That means you’ll get audio/video on demand in the 158 seats in the back of the bus and international Business Elite in the 16 seats up front. LA will be up and running here in early September but it looks like SF won’t be fully outfitted with the new aircraft until late October.

Delta Wants to Fight in NYC - LA/SF

This is not only a product improvement but it’s a capacity increase. Delta has been flying a mix of 757s and 737s on these routes lately, and now they’ll be all 757. So what’s behind this increase in capacity and improvement in product? Remember, they want to “win” New York.

United has ps and American flies its 767-200s between New York and SF/LA, both of which have an international three cabin product. So this enables Delta to try to compete for some of that business, though the product will still be inferior to what the other two are offering. At least it will now be in the same category.

If that’s not good enough, Delta probably has some spare 757s sitting around. As we head into winter, the already bad international travel market is going to start looking even worse. So Delta can pull those 757s off of weak international routes and put them on less weak domestic routes instead. I tend to think this won’t be a winner if you look at the bottom line, but if they want to “win” New York, as they like to say, they need to do something to compete in these markets.

I doubt this will be enough to steal away the corporate business from United and American, but it very well be less of a loss maker than sticking them on Transatlantic routes during the long winter ahead.

The big thing at NBTA seems to be showing off seats. Dozens of airlines seemed to have brought their seats with them to make the travel managers drool. While most simply showed off the best seats onboard, others brought everything from coach all the way up. When I stopped by American, I was particularly interested in their new coach seat which is being installed on new 737-800s and some 757s as well. After all, I spend most of my time in coach, so that’s where I get most interested.

The new seat doesn’t recline like a traditional seat. It now actually slides a little forward and up while reclining less than it used to. This gives a very slight cradling feeling when you’re sitting there. Here’s a short 30 second video I took for those who aren’t familiar with the seat.


I know other airlines have moved this way, but I’ve heard mixed reviews. American’s display was quite misleading because there was no seat in front of you. That meant that when the seat moved slightly forward, you still had a ton of leg and knee room. Obviously, that’s a different story than when you’re on the plane.

Who out there has opinions on this? Is this new design any good or do you prefer the old way of doing things?

(And no, you can’t have it where you get the old seats but the person in front of you gets the new ones that don’t recline very far.)

There was an interesting survey that came out earlier this month showing that people hate the middle seat far more than I could ever imagine. While I usually like to blame the surveyor, I think this is a case Survey Says . . .of the respondents not telling the truth.

Let’s start with the responses that make sense. Eighty percent of travelers say they try to avoid the middle seat and only 1% say they prefer it. (Who the heck are those 1%?) But those numbers don’t sound too far off. It also says that 56% would rather be stuck in traffic or go on a blind date. Ok, not so bad. Then it runs into trouble.

Apparently 50% of people would take an aisle seat on the next flight over a middle seat on their current flight. And even more astounding, 20% said they would stay overnight if they could avoid a middle seat on their flight. A full 9% said they would outright refuse a middle seat. Are you freakin’ kidding me?!? I can certainly see a few random big and tall folks being willing to stay overnight, but not 20%. That’s insane.

In this case, the surveyor doesn’t really have a skin in the game. It was put out by 3M Privacy Filters. You know those things – they go over your computer screen so that someone sitting close to you can’t look over your shoulder and see what you’re doing. All they care about is that middle seats exist, because that’s when you really need them. They don’t care if you like them or not.

So I think the respondents here aren’t being truthful. This survey was administered online, and it’s really easy to say you’d wait for the next flight when you’re answering from the comfort of your home. You go find me someone with a middle seat boarding pass waiting to board a flight and then you’ll get dramatically different answers.

In fact, let’s throw a survey out here and see what you guys think. Airline employees shouldn’t answer this one. As a former nonrev pro, I know the correct answer for an airline employee is “I will take absolutely any seat you give me as long as it gets me closer to home.”

Would you walk away from your middle seat and stay overnight in an airport hotel for an aisle seat on the first flight the next morning?

View Results

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(If you can’t see the survey, go directly to the post)

By the way, possibly the most disturbing thing in this survey was that only 6% of people said the middle seat gets both armrests. I imagine this may generate the most discussion down below, but that is the correct answer. If you’re stuck in the middle, you get both armrests. It’s a small consolation, yes, but it’s the least you deserve. Just don’t go trying to raise that armrest . . . .


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