Browsing Posts in Seats

Ok, so I didn’t actually take the new saddle seat for a test ride. I mean, it was a static display in the Airline Interiors Expo hall, but I did get to sit in it for awhile and check it out. The verdict? It’s absolutely uncomfortable, but I think it’s a great idea. Kudos to Aviointeriors for at least trying to come up with a solution that matches passenger demand. The only problem? I can’t see how this passes regulatory hurdles. So I suppose I should put those kudos on ice.

You’ve heard about this thing, right? Well, if not, take a look at this bad boy:

The Saddle Seat

But that picture doesn’t really tell the story. Instead, take a look at this picture with me squeezing myself into the second row.

Aviointeriors Saddle Seat Legroom

As you can see, I’ve got a wedgie like no other. Kind of like when I first went horizontal in an angled lie-flat seat. The seat itself isn’t very comfortable. It has no moving parts, so tall people are in real trouble. (You’d think they’d have an up and down function for tall people, but that adds parts and weight. They may need to rethink that.) It doesn’t recline either. There is a tray table, but good luck using it for anything. Oh, and the armrests are even narrower than in coach. That combined with the fact that the saddle seat pushes your legs sideways means you’ll have a very intimate experience with your next-door neighbor.

Aviointeriors Saddle Seat

So, uh, what do I like about this? Well, there are a lot of people that just want cheap fares. This seat weighs a lot less than a regular seat (the goal is to get it under 5kg per seat) and it takes up a lot less space. So that means lower fares can mean higher profit. This seat has 23 inches of pitch, which means that it’s 23 inches from the front of one seat to the front of the next seat. Compare that to a roughly industry standard 31 inches, and you can fit a lot more in a space.

Let’s look at a Spirit A321. Spirit has roughly 30 to 31 inches of pitch, but let’s just assume it’s 31 inches for simplicity sake. Here’s what the back cabin would look like with the saddle seat.

Spirit Saddle Seat Mock

Instead of 82 seats in the back cabin, you can probably squeeze 112 in. Pretty good, eh? But let’s put this another way. If Spirit needs to make $75 per seat on a given flight to break even today, adding the saddle seat in that back section could bring in the same amount of revenue at only $55 per seat. That’s a big difference for the passenger.

I don’t see this kind of seat as being the kind of thing most airlines would want, but even those that do wouldn’t outfit their entire cabins with this seat. Think of it as Economy Minus. (or, on United, Economy Minus Minus.) I could see low cost airlines with a large percentage of short haul flights looking to take advantage of this seat. Think of Spirit, Allegiant, Air Asia, and yes, Ryanair. If the price is right, people will do it. It’s the right fit for some airlines, and I imagine we’ll see someone try something similar at some point.

But there is one huge, ugly problem. Regulation. The Aviointeriors people said that they’ve been in touch with the regulatory bodies and they don’t foresee a problem, but I do. In particular, I wonder if these seats will be able to meet evacuation test rules which require everyone to be out of the plane within a certain amount of time. Also, the seatbelt wasn’t on the seat, but it rides really low over your legs. I think that may need to be changed. (I wish it had a harness to keep you from spilling over and prevent you from breaking your skull on the seat in front.)

But if they can get past the regulatory problems (and that’s a HUGE “if”) this seems like a great idea to me. I, however, will be happy to pay more for a real seat.

Well, well. It looks like the long-awaited reconfiguration of United’s 777s has begun and the first airplane United 777 Config Updatewill be put into service very soon. As I mentioned more than a year ago (to a healthy does of skepticism), these planes are coming out with a 3-3-3 configuration in economy instead of the 2-5-2 they have today. Once these planes are done, then the 777 will once again be desirable up front, unlike today.

I’ve heard from multiple people that the first plane is being reconfigured right now. When it comes out, there will be fewer premium seats and more in the back of the bus. Here’s a comparison versus what’s out there today:

Class New Seats Current Seats
First 8 updated suites 10-12 suites
Business 40 flat beds 45-49 cradle seats
Economy Plus 101-104 seats 77-84 seats
Economy Minus 117 seats 110-115 seats

This looks like a good configuration to me, and it’s roughly what had been discussed before. The increase in Economy Plus seating is a nice bonus, but these aren’t the only changes. I understand that there will now be regular 110 volt power outlets throughout the plane. This is a huge step for United since they have been lagging in the power department for ages. Each seat gets power in First and Business. In the back, there will be two outlets for every three seats, another good reason (on top of general standardization of seats) for having the 3-3-3 configuration.

There will also be new, updated screens throughout the airplane. Up front, it will be full audio/video on demand as is the case on the 767 and 747 today, but in the back, it’s a little less clear. I am holding out hope that there is audio/video on demand and not just looping movies, because that would be insane to install less than the industry standard these days. That being said, I understand that they will be looking at charging for premium movies. So maybe it will have looping channels for free and audio/video on demand will cost. That doesn’t really bother me that much as long as the AVOD option is there. [Update: United confirms that there will be audio/video on demand in all classes and there will be no charge.]

The only bad part about this? The transition. It’s gonna suck. When the configuration changes from 2-5-2 to 3-3-3, people who thought they had aisles could end up in the middle. Families could find themselves separated by the aisle. It could get really ugly, so I’m hoping that they do a good job of keeping these planes on dedicated routes.

I asked United to confirm what I had heard late on Friday, but I still have not received word one way or the other. If I hear back from them, I’ll update it here. [Update: United has now confirmed this. The only thing that's unclear is whether or not there will be a charge for entertainment in coach.]

[In an unrelated note, I'm experimenting with putting posts up earlier so that you east coast folks can get your fill in the morning. The emails will still be sent at the same time, but my hope is to schedule posts to go live on the site by 7a Eastern. We'll see how this goes.]

While some airlines are moving away from First Class, British Airways continues to embrace it. They’ve just rolled out the latest version of their First Class product, and it seems very, well, British. I like that about BA, even though I highly doubt I’ll ever sit in these seats.

I consider myself something of an Anglophile, so I like the traditional, stuffy British style, stiff upper lip and all. That’s why I was with Margaret Thatcher when she condemned those silly world tails. People want British Airways to be British. And when it comes to First Class, I want some of that traditional British service. Heck, you can put Mr Belvedere up there and I’d even be happy. So here’s what they’ve done.

BA New F Seat

If you know BA’s First Class, this seat will look fairly similar. In fact, the biggest difference is that, as you can see, Rachel Weisz is now included in the price of the ticket. This isn’t a Singapore-style suite where you’re completely and totally closed off from the world, so you and Rachel will have to be discreet. Some people may not be thrilled that they don’t have a closed-off suite, but for some reason, it really doesn’t bother me.

The one thing that really stands out is the window. I know that sounds dumb, but it’s incredible how much that impacts the cabin feel. Unfortunately, the BA stock photos don’t show the window very well, so I took the one that got closest. To see some great pics, go to Business Traveller’s coverage.

As you can see, they’ve put inside paneling that effectively eliminates the round window that we’ve all come to expect on an airplane. There are now blinds on bigger interior windows that, when closed, make you forget you’re on a plane. It’s a pretty cool effect in pictures. I can’t wait to see what it looks like on an airplane (undoubtedly as I’m turning right to go to a lesser class).

Some of the little touches are nice as well. For example, you’ll find a wardrobe in each seat so you can hang your clothes. There is also a leather-bound desk. Totally unnecessary, but then again, isn’t First Class in general?

The seat has been installed on a single 777 so far, but it sounds like it’ll be awhile before it starts going on to the rest of the fleet. Guess we’ll all just have to wait.

Delta may have lost over $1 billion in 2009, but that’s not stopping them from pushing forward on improving their product offerings. In fact, the day before they announced earnings, they also announced a slew of onboard improvements. I’m glad to see it, but there is still one glaring omission here.

Delta is now committing to putting lie flat seats on all 777, 767, and 747 aircraft that fly internationally. That’s great news, because right now it’s a crapshoot on some of these fleets. The 777 LR aircraft have flat beds but the ERs don’t. The 767-400s have some with flat beds but others don’t and the 767-300s don’t. Now all 777s will have the same flat bed while all the 767s will have an alternate flat bed. I think it’s time to break out my old chart, updated with this news:

Delta's New Plan for First Class

The big question (literally) is what they’ll put on the 747. They haven’t picked which seat they’ll use, but I’m sure it’ll be completely different from the 767 and 777 just to make things confusing. After all, the cabin width dictated that they use different beds in the 777 than the 767, so I don’t see why that wouldn’t impact the 747 decision as well.

The A330s will apparently still have the old Northwest WorldBusiness seats, and the 757s will keep the old Delta Biz Elite seats. But what about those CRJ-700s?

Ok, so those likely won’t be the exact seats, but Delta is installing First Class on 66 CRJ-700 aircraft operated by Connection carriers. This is undoubtedly meant to compete with United’s ExPlus and American’s recent decision to do the same on its CRJ-700s. These planes are flying more and more longer, former mainline routes so they need something to reward the elites, I suppose.

But what are they doing for the back of the bus? First and most importantly, the 747s and the 767-300s will have audio/video on demand installed at each seat. I assume this is a cost savings, because it gets expensive to pay for the monkeys that actually sit in the projector and run the movie on the big screen today. There is already AVOD in coach on the rest of the international fleet, so that will now be standard.

They’ll also be putting Delta’s blue leather seats on the Northwest fleet (eh, I like cloth) in coach, and more importantly, they’ll be installing the bigger overhead bins on Northwest’s 757s so you can fit rollerbags straight in.

Anything else? Yeah, they’re going to renovate the SkyClub at LAX and open new clubs in Seattle, Philly, and Indianapolis. The Philly one surprises me, but the Indy and Seattle ones don’t. This will be the only lounge in Indy, so that’s nice, and it’s a sign that they aren’t planning on abandoning the city as a little Heartland focus operation. With in-laws in Indy, I’m happy about that.

What’s the one big piece that I said they were missing at the beginning of this post? No word on JFK terminal upgrades. Seriously, this needs to happen. I shot off a question to Delta after seeing nothing regarding New York and they assured me that I’ll be notified as soon as something is ready to announce. You’ll know as soon as I do.

It had been hinted about around the local media here in New Zealand for the last few days, but now its official. If you fly in Lying Down on the Sky Couchcoach on Air New Zealand, you’ll be able to lie down, well, some of you will. I was at the big reveal of the new interior yesterday, and I liked what I saw.

All three cabins are getting a makeover, though the business cabin is a much more minor change than the rest. The process has taken them more than 3 years, and they hired famed design firm IDEO to work with them along with several local structural design firms. (Read more about the process on BNET.) The result is what CEO Rob Fyfe required – a new, superior product that takes up no more space than the old product and costs the traveler the same amount for a seat. They’ve done just that in coach.

The best way to have a look is to watch this 8 minute video. Ed Sims, Group General Manager of the International Airline for Air New Zealand, walked me through each cabin talking about what’s changing. Take a look and then let’s talk below.

They’ve been saying this product is revolutionary; is it? To some extent, yes. Clearly the business class isn’t revolutionary, but the other two cabins are quite innovative to say the least. I guess the best way to answer this is . . . are there any other economy cabins in the world that allow you to lie down? Unless you’re on an empty flight, the answer is no. Here’s what they’re doing.

Economy Class
When the new economy class rolls out on the 777, you might be dismayed to see that it’s going to be in a 3-4-3 configuration. That’s one more across than in the standard configuration, but many airlines have gone toward that model. The width will now be around 17.2 inches, about what you’ll find on a standard 737, but less than that you’ll get on say, United’s 777s.

Of course, while United may give you more width, Air NZ gives you a couple inches more legroom. The 777-300 will have mostly 33 inch pitch Attached Pillow in Coachthroughout, and I found it to be quite comfortable, even if it is 1 inch less than what you get on the 747s today.

There will be 246 coach seats on the plane, and they’ll all have individual power outlets, USB ports to watch your own content on their entertainment system, a screen that is 2 inches larger than the current large screen, and foot nets to rest your feet. Personally, I don’t like foot nets, but it’s better than nothing, I suppose.

While many airlines have gone toward the winged headrests in coach, Air NZ is taking it one step further. They’re now attaching pillows to the winged headrest to make for a really comfortable place to put your head.

Of those seats, 66 on the sides of the first 11 rows of coach will be part of the new SkyCouch offering. If you’re an individual, the only difference is that instead of a foot net, there are full leg rests. If you want to sit in these seats, you’ll be able to pay about US$150 more, but that’s not the real value.

The value comes when you use Modeling How the SkyCouch Worksthe three seats together to turn into a bed. The seats will already be designed to be flush with each other so you can lie down. The armrests will also go all the way up. Meanwhile, the legrests will all come up to fill in the area where your legs usually go to create a big bed. Two short people can cuddle up while taller people would need to prop their heads up against the wall to avoid getting run over by carts.

Since Air NZ serves a high percentage of leisure traffic, these seats are meant for couples and families. If a couple books the two seats, they’ll be able to buy the third for half the price to make a more affordable option for lying down than you’ll find in premium cabins. If you have a family of three, you can pay $150 more for everyone to share the area together. If your kid can lie down, your flight will be much better.

Premium Economy
This is a very compelling option. While the current premium economy isn’t much of an upgrade, these are real premium seats that should be considered more like “business lite.” The configuration is 2-2-2, but the center is different from the sides. The Premium Economy Inner Space with Ottocenter seats, which they’re calling inner space, face in toward each other, and the large armrests go up. When they do, you can change your position to face each other and even have a meal. The tray table comes down at an angle so you can put your food on the armrest and a laptop on your table. Room for everything.

There are no legrests in this cabin but rather Otto the bean bag. Seriously. Otto can be moved around to be used as a legrest no matter which way you’re sitting. The point of these seats is to allow you to move around and fidget as much as you’d like and have plenty of comfortable positions available. Very well done.

The outside seats both angle toward the window, so they’re meant more for the individual traveler. You can still talk to each other if you’re a couple, but these really also give you privacy if you’re not. This cabin really seems to be all about flexibility and choice.

Business
Other than the shiny new white leather (which they really think won’t get scuffed up, uh huh), not a ton is changing here. The seat is the same, though the screen will also grow a couple inches. The big change is the mattress. Right now, some passengers complain Business Class After I Messed It Upthat the mattress is too hard, so they’re adding an inch or so of new padding to soften it up. They’re also including a mattress pad that adds additional padding and a new duvet. I tried it; it’s quite nice.

Other than that, there will be changes to the meal service. They’re actually installing ovens on the plane to cook the food instead of simply reheat it. They’re looking toward a menu of comfort food since that’s what people seem to really like. In the premium cabins, this will be more of a “bistro” style of offering, but it goes back to coach as well. They showed off a mammoth burger for coach that looked delicious. Oh, and like Virgin America, you’ll be able to order food and drink when you’d like from your seatback entertainment system.

Overall, I think they’ve done a really nice job here. If you’re a family or a couple, this is really the first affordable flat bed option that I’ve seen in the skies. Or if you just want to fidget, the premium economy was really impressive.

These seats will first roll out on NZ 5/6 between LA and Auckland beginning before the end of the year. In April, it will shift to NZ 1/2 and go Auckland – LA – London. Eventually, it will be on every long haul flight. The 747s will be retired and the 777-200s will be refitted with this interior.

[See all my photos of the new Air New Zealand cabin here]


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