Comments on: The New Alitalia Has Low Loads, Big Losses, and New Competition http://crankyflier.com/2009/03/05/the-new-alitalia-has-low-loads-big-losses-and-new-competition/ Fri, 10 Feb 2012 00:32:03 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Tom http://crankyflier.com/2009/03/05/the-new-alitalia-has-low-loads-big-losses-and-new-competition/comment-page-1/#comment-91058 Tom Sat, 02 Jan 2010 17:17:34 +0000 http://crankyflier.com/?p=2226#comment-91058 Bologna is one of the most amazing places in Italy! Bologna is one of the most amazing places in Italy!

]]> By: godfather http://crankyflier.com/2009/03/05/the-new-alitalia-has-low-loads-big-losses-and-new-competition/comment-page-1/#comment-71502 godfather Sun, 15 Mar 2009 07:23:02 +0000 http://crankyflier.com/?p=2226#comment-71502 The NEW MANAGEMENT is just a wank. Rocco has no f...g idea about airline management, he is yesterday' s man. He gave a friend of mine his private email addy and could not even remember it. Electronic distribution, rostering systems, revenue management - no idea. And he surrounded himself with italian speaking mates - because he does not speak english very well. Interesting enough the new shareholders have confidence..until it hurts. The airline world laughs at "new alitalia"... The NEW MANAGEMENT is just a wank.
Rocco has no f…g idea about airline management, he is yesterday’ s man. He gave a friend of mine his private email addy and could not even remember it. Electronic distribution, rostering systems, revenue management – no idea. And he surrounded himself with italian speaking mates – because he does not speak english very well.

Interesting enough the new shareholders have confidence..until it hurts.

The airline world laughs at “new alitalia”…

]]> By: Italy News: 03.08.09 | Italy Travel Guide http://crankyflier.com/2009/03/05/the-new-alitalia-has-low-loads-big-losses-and-new-competition/comment-page-1/#comment-71251 Italy News: 03.08.09 | Italy Travel Guide Sun, 08 Mar 2009 08:52:18 +0000 http://crankyflier.com/?p=2226#comment-71251 [...] Not surprisingly, even though Alitalia’s under new management there’s still plenty to be cranky about. [...] [...] Not surprisingly, even though Alitalia’s under new management there’s still plenty to be cranky about. [...]

]]> By: Rui A. http://crankyflier.com/2009/03/05/the-new-alitalia-has-low-loads-big-losses-and-new-competition/comment-page-1/#comment-71192 Rui A. Fri, 06 Mar 2009 14:27:24 +0000 http://crankyflier.com/?p=2226#comment-71192 Oh, and by the way, Cranky, I loooove these Alitalia posts. They never fail to entertain me. Oh, and by the way, Cranky, I loooove these Alitalia posts. They never fail to entertain me.

]]> By: Rui A. http://crankyflier.com/2009/03/05/the-new-alitalia-has-low-loads-big-losses-and-new-competition/comment-page-1/#comment-71191 Rui A. Fri, 06 Mar 2009 14:24:21 +0000 http://crankyflier.com/?p=2226#comment-71191 I actually lived in Florence for 3 months last year and used Bologna's Guglielmo Marconi Airport to travel back and forth to Portugal. The trip between Florence and Bologna took little over an hour on the ES-type trains, and it travelled through a lot of valleys and tunnels, without many turns or decelerations as it was. I'm not quite sure how they will shave off 45 minutes in this particular segment, although I can imagine the AV trains really cranking it up in the Florence-Rome and Bologna-Milano segments, which consist basically of long straight segments, suitable for high-speed travels. I think Alitalia is (even more) screwed now... I actually lived in Florence for 3 months last year and used Bologna’s Guglielmo Marconi Airport to travel back and forth to Portugal. The trip between Florence and Bologna took little over an hour on the ES-type trains, and it travelled through a lot of valleys and tunnels, without many turns or decelerations as it was. I’m not quite sure how they will shave off 45 minutes in this particular segment, although I can imagine the AV trains really cranking it up in the Florence-Rome and Bologna-Milano segments, which consist basically of long straight segments, suitable for high-speed travels.

I think Alitalia is (even more) screwed now…

]]> By: Ron http://crankyflier.com/2009/03/05/the-new-alitalia-has-low-loads-big-losses-and-new-competition/comment-page-1/#comment-71169 Ron Thu, 05 Mar 2009 21:19:30 +0000 http://crankyflier.com/?p=2226#comment-71169 Rob -- high-speed trains can run on regular tracks, they just do it at the speed of regular trains. Currently a train from Rome to Milan takes 3:59 hours with stops in Florence and Bologna, or 3:30 without stops (presumably using the same route). When the tracks between Florence and Bologna are upgraded, the same trains will go faster. Though I don't see where exactly they can shave off a full 45 minutes, given that the segment between Florence and Bologna currently takes only 1:01 hours. Rob — high-speed trains can run on regular tracks, they just do it at the speed of regular trains. Currently a train from Rome to Milan takes 3:59 hours with stops in Florence and Bologna, or 3:30 without stops (presumably using the same route). When the tracks between Florence and Bologna are upgraded, the same trains will go faster. Though I don’t see where exactly they can shave off a full 45 minutes, given that the segment between Florence and Bologna currently takes only 1:01 hours.

]]> By: rob http://crankyflier.com/2009/03/05/the-new-alitalia-has-low-loads-big-losses-and-new-competition/comment-page-1/#comment-71167 rob Thu, 05 Mar 2009 20:41:00 +0000 http://crankyflier.com/?p=2226#comment-71167 David, I'm a little confused with the high speed train routes you've mentioned. It seems, from the way you've mentioned them, that these are essentially three separate routes (i.e. one train will go Rome-Florence and back, another from Florence-Bologna, etc). I say this because, according to the way you've described it, the middle leg of the journey will be the last one running. So at least at this point, it's being done on separate trains. If that's the case, then you have to factor in to your calculations that you've got two changes, and possible wait time. Of course, if these waits are both in the 10-15 minute range, and you're not traveling with much luggage, it may still make more sense. But, if the waits are too long, then you pass that three hour threshold. Conversely, if the waits are too short, you might not be too keen on the idea of having only 5 minutes or so to get off of one train, go under the platform, then come up on another line in time to catch your next train, if you've got any luggage at all (all while keeping your zegna suit in pristene condition, your bruno maglis free of smudges, and possibly stopping for an espresso). Of course, if what you're talking about is actually a single high-speed train from Rome to Milan, with stops in Florence and Bologna, that's a separate issue. David, I’m a little confused with the high speed train routes you’ve mentioned.

It seems, from the way you’ve mentioned them, that these are essentially three separate routes (i.e. one train will go Rome-Florence and back, another from Florence-Bologna, etc). I say this because, according to the way you’ve described it, the middle leg of the journey will be the last one running. So at least at this point, it’s being done on separate trains.

If that’s the case, then you have to factor in to your calculations that you’ve got two changes, and possible wait time. Of course, if these waits are both in the 10-15 minute range, and you’re not traveling with much luggage, it may still make more sense. But, if the waits are too long, then you pass that three hour threshold. Conversely, if the waits are too short, you might not be too keen on the idea of having only 5 minutes or so to get off of one train, go under the platform, then come up on another line in time to catch your next train, if you’ve got any luggage at all (all while keeping your zegna suit in pristene condition, your bruno maglis free of smudges, and possibly stopping for an espresso).

Of course, if what you’re talking about is actually a single high-speed train from Rome to Milan, with stops in Florence and Bologna, that’s a separate issue.

]]> By: David http://crankyflier.com/2009/03/05/the-new-alitalia-has-low-loads-big-losses-and-new-competition/comment-page-1/#comment-71166 David Thu, 05 Mar 2009 20:17:34 +0000 http://crankyflier.com/?p=2226#comment-71166 Follow up to my last comment... the Bologna - Florence high speed line should open in late 2009. This will mean the faster trains from Milan to Rome running in just 2h45m - probably quick enough to attract the premium fare paying traffic. It's beginning to look rather similiar to the Madrid - Barcelona route in Spain Follow up to my last comment… the Bologna – Florence high speed line should open in late 2009. This will mean the faster trains from Milan to Rome running in just 2h45m – probably quick enough to attract the premium fare paying traffic.

It’s beginning to look rather similiar to the Madrid – Barcelona route in Spain

]]> By: David http://crankyflier.com/2009/03/05/the-new-alitalia-has-low-loads-big-losses-and-new-competition/comment-page-1/#comment-71163 David Thu, 05 Mar 2009 18:05:42 +0000 http://crankyflier.com/?p=2226#comment-71163 In December last year, a new high-speed train line opened between Milan and Bologna cutting 30 mins off the ride. There is already a high speed line from Rome to Florence. This means that a train from central Rome to central Milan goes every hour and takes under 4 hours. OK, not quite the 3-hour barrier at which planes lose the ability to compete, but it probably makes it a bit less lucrative for airlines than it has been. In December last year, a new high-speed train line opened between Milan and Bologna cutting 30 mins off the ride. There is already a high speed line from Rome to Florence. This means that a train from central Rome to central Milan goes every hour and takes under 4 hours.

OK, not quite the 3-hour barrier at which planes lose the ability to compete, but it probably makes it a bit less lucrative for airlines than it has been.

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